Duas No More. Options

[AsadullahHamza]

No soul has authority over another. Guidance and straying is a matter between God and you.



aakwrAllahwbHu


A while back I had started the practice of dhikr, which, for me, was basically repeating certain phrases and the Names of God. The impact it had on me was pretty immediate and spectacular in the sense that I used to find a lot of tranquility and peace durng my short dhikr sessions. And very soon I started experiencing something more -- worldly benefits. And it was something which I couldn't put down to a natural flow of events.

Of course, it wasn't exactly magic or even like getting hold of a jinn, but I realized that I was in possession of a very powerful tool. It was like I didn't even have to ask (for something), I just had to do dhikr. I was so thrilled that I started to advise my family and my friends and even strangers to do dhikr. I remember telling half a dozen of my non-Muslim friends to repeat "Alhamdulillah" and "Subhanallah" and other dhikrable words. And I was telling anybody who would care to listen, "Do dhikr!!" Sort of like bragging, too, I suppose.

Then the downslide. A few months later I realized that it wasn't working any longer. No matter how much dhikr I did, things were simply not turning out the way they would during the last few months. To cut the story short, I then stopped doing dhikr. Very soon I stopped making duas as well, because I figured it really didn't matter whether or not I prayed for something. Of course, now I do realize, looking back, that the reason I had started doing dhikr was not to get worldly benefits but to seek closeness to Allah. And when Allah tested me with His favors, I completely lost sight of what my goal was and made the world my aim. And, now, no matter how much dhikr I do, I experience neither peace nor the worldly benefits.

But my query is related to my no longer supplicating Allah for anything. It's not the case that I believe that Allah does not have the Power to answer my supplication (audhubillah), it's just that I feel He won't.

So, if I want something but I don't ask Allah for it, is it disbelief or ingratitude or something negative? JazakAllah.


Alhamdu lillahi Rabbil aalameen.



la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Al-‘Atheemu Al-Haleemu, la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbul ‘arshil-‘atheemi,
la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbus-samaawaati wa Rabbul-ardhi wa Rabbul-‘arshil-kareemi
there is no god except Allah, the All-Mighty, the Forbearing; there is no god except Allah, the Lord of the Mighty Throne;
there is no god except Allah, Lord of the heavens, Lord of the earth and Lord of the noble Throne.

[msazad]

Do you care about the opinion of someone who isn't Muslim?
This forum is called "ask a Muslim" but doesn't tell non-Muslims or non-scholars to stay away like some others and some of the things you talk about aren't specific to Islam.

You don't sound like a disbeliever at all. Don't torture yourself over that. But when you say "I feel He won't", that may be presumption on your part. Maybe when you say "Allah tested me with His favors" it is presumption as well. I don't know.
Ingrates are those who do not give thanks. Not asking is not ingratitude. If you don't ask because you're not sure what would be best for instance, surely you can not be faulted.
Not doing something is negative in a sense. But as you know it is wise not to do certain things.

It sounds like your dhikr practice was powerful but confusing. Such reactions seem common when stumbling on something powerful. It sounds like you learned something from this confusion in the end. So give thanks for that.
I think it would be a shame to give up your dhikr practice considering the effect it had on you. But it may be wiser to do it without any expectations. I'm not only talking about these worldly benefits you mentioned but about every expectation including tranquility and closeness to Allah. If you keep an open mind and pay attention maybe with some patience you will understand better what happens when you do your dhikr.

I hope you find peace.

[AsadullahHamza]

No soul has authority over another. Guidance and straying is a matter between God and you.



aakwrAllahwbHu

Do you care about the opinion of someone who isn't Muslim?

Most of the time 'Muslim,' 'non-Muslim,' 'Shia,' 'Sunni' are just labels. Or excuses. That's what I think.

This forum is called "ask a Muslim" but doesn't tell non-Muslims or non-scholars to stay away like some others and some of the things you talk about aren't specific to Islam.

I was searching for "ask a Member" section to post this, but couldn't find it. Philosophical debate it isn't, so I opted for this section. And I am glad you replied.

You don't sound like a disbeliever at all. Don't torture yourself over that.

Yes, I don't sound like one. :-)

But when you say "I feel He won't", that may be presumption on your part. Maybe when you say "Allah tested me with His favors" it is presumption as well. I don't know.

I don't know for sure, either. But that's the way I look at it.

Ingrates are those who do not give thanks.

And how does one give thanks?

Not asking is not ingratitude. If you don't ask because you're not sure what would be best for instance, surely you can not be faulted.

Not doing something is negative in a sense. But as you know it is wise not to do certain things.

It sounds like your dhikr practice was powerful but confusing. Such reactions seem common when stumbling on something powerful. It sounds like you learned something from this confusion in the end. So give thanks for that.
I think it would be a shame to give up your dhikr practice considering the effect it had on you. But it may be wiser to do it without any expectations. I'm not only talking about these worldly benefits you mentioned but about every expectation including tranquility and closeness to Allah. If you keep an open mind and pay attention maybe with some patience you will understand better what happens when you do your dhikr.

To reply to what you have said I would probably need to write an essay. And I am not much at talking. So I will simply ponder over your good counsel. May Allah reward you with better. :-)

I realize that it might be the thing to do to recommence dhikr the way I began doing it the first time around. And I just need to figure a way how. And try and avoid the previous mistakes, inshallah.

For now, I have to sort out the supplication part -- how long to persist with a supplication and when to start looking at alternatives. If I don't supplicate, a voice demands, "Why don't you ask Allah?" When I do, a voice whispers, "How long are you going to keep asking?"

I hope you find peace.

May God reward your kindness with better. Alhamdu lillahi Rabbil aalameen.

JazakAllah, again, brother. Take care. :-)



Alhamdu lillahi Rabbil aalameen.



la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Al-‘Atheemu Al-Haleemu, la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbul ‘arshil-‘atheemi,
la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbus-samaawaati wa Rabbul-ardhi wa Rabbul-‘arshil-kareemi
there is no god except Allah, the All-Mighty, the Forbearing; there is no god except Allah, the Lord of the Mighty Throne;
there is no god except Allah, Lord of the heavens, Lord of the earth and Lord of the noble Throne.

This post has been edited by AsadullahHamza: Apr 16 2011, 03:13 AM

[Killed Bill]

It's not the case that I believe that Allah does not have the Power to answer my supplication (audhubillah), it's just that I feel He won't.

Who else can provide for anything you want or need?

You understand your pure dependence on Him so whatever you may need or want can only come from Him.

You used this dhikr for something it was not intended for, and this is maybe why you arent experiencing those benefits anymore.

When you no longer have any need or concern about anything of this world, it is then you are granted those rights

[AsadullahHamza]

No soul has authority over another. Guidance and straying is a matter between God and you.



aakwrAllahwbHu

You used this dhikr for something it was not intended for, and this is maybe why you arent experiencing those benefits anymore.

When you no longer have any need or concern about anything of this world, it is then you are granted those rights

I probably agree. My purpose for doing dhikr pretty much changed. And my telling all and sundry to do dhikr, I think there must be a problem over there, too. My reliance possibly shifted from Allah to my dhikr sessions(=myself). Anyway, I have pretty much lost all hopes regarding dhikr, and what's been occupying my mind is the supplication dilemma. All the same, jazakAllah for some fine observations, brother. :-)

Who else can provide for anything you want or need?

You understand your pure dependence on Him so whatever you may need or want can only come from Him.

Then how long should I keep supplicating? When should I start looking at other options?

I was the kind who when he prays believes that Allah will respond so that I would keep waiting for a favorable response. Maybe this attitude is not correct, and I need to be more real to start with. And honestly, this has proved self-destructive quite often. So the dilemma for me is how long should I keep supplicating, and when should I ("get real" and) start looking at my options!!

JazakAllah, again, my brother. May Allah reward you with better.


Alhamdu lillahi Rabbil aalameen.



la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Al-‘Atheemu Al-Haleemu, la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbul ‘arshil-‘atheemi,
la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbus-samaawaati wa Rabbul-ardhi wa Rabbul-‘arshil-kareemi
there is no god except Allah, the All-Mighty, the Forbearing; there is no god except Allah, the Lord of the Mighty Throne;
there is no god except Allah, Lord of the heavens, Lord of the earth and Lord of the noble Throne.

[msazad]

Your question ("And how does one give thanks?") is surprising, brother Asadullah. Is it not what you do when you say Hallelujah (Alhamdulillah) for example? But I will try to answer it anyway.
We speak English so we use Christian words and ideas like "giving thanks" even though we are not Christians. But I did not refer specifically to Christian ways. So how might people give thanks?
I suppose the ancient made a lot of offerings in sacred places or to idols, sometimes symbolic and sometimes substantial. Some people still use such rituals of course. Some will also in a less ritualized manner give some or all of their wealth to religious or charitable organizations. There are also those who will express gratitude by taking vows, religious or otherwise. Sometimes the vow involves to making of an offering at a later date. And there are those who will give thanks by being kind or helping other people like beggars.
Many religions have thanksgiving rituals which do not involve offerings, like specific prayers to say at certain times. All over the world, there are traditional phrases people say in gratitude. They are so common that non-religious people have adopted them. You will for instance find programmers humorously saying "Thank $deity!". Gratitude apparently expressed towards other people (I assume this is what you mean when you say JazakAllah) can also have an implicit religious significance.
Some will show gratitude negatively by refraining from complaints and by not asking (this may not always be wise as it could easily lead to hypocrisy). And I guess people do lots of other things.
I do not wish to speak against any of these traditions and rituals but, personally, I think that these actions are impure if they are carried for the achievement of a duty or ideal of thanksgiving instead of for their own sake. I sometimes do some of the things I mentioned anyway but I think what matters is to have gratitute in one's thoughts and feelings. I also think that the rituals one does in public should be explained, especially if others are asked to participate, even implicitely. Even if you think it is a tradition that everyone should understand, it could be not everyone does. And misunderstanding can lead to unfortunate consequences.
I must say that I think I have some experience with ingratitude and disbelief, which is why I answered your initial query. According to my beliefs, ingratitude is not haram so I don't mind being an occasional ingrate.

There's something else you said I find puzzling: "how long to persist with a supplication and when to start looking at alternatives." Maybe I don't understand what you mean by "alternatives" but can you not do things that make it more likely you will get what you want while you are supplicating? Surely believing that everything ultimately comes from Allah doesn't mean you should be passive or unrealistic!
Is there really a time at which you are supposed to stop supplicating by the way?

You also wrote: "I realize that it might be the thing to do to recommence dhikr the way I began doing it the first time around. And I just need to figure a way how." That may be impossible. There is only one first time. You have changed and you have learned. Now you can do something different. Trying to relive the past is rarely fruitful. But if you want to try anyway, I hope you succeed.

[AsadullahHamza]

No soul has authority over another. Guidance and straying is a matter between God and you.



aakwrAllahwbHu


I started to reply, realized that I had written more than two foolscap full, and then decided not to publish it. I hope you will understand.

Also, I did realize that you were not making a specific reference to Christian ways.

JazakAllah for all your kindness, brother. Glad that posting this in "ask a Muslim" section did not come in the way. May Allah SWT reward you with better. :-)

JazakAllah, again, to both of you. Take care, brothers.


Alhamdu lillahi Rabbil aalameen.



la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Al-‘Atheemu Al-Haleemu, la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbul ‘arshil-‘atheemi,
la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbus-samaawaati wa Rabbul-ardhi wa Rabbul-‘arshil-kareemi
there is no god except Allah, the All-Mighty, the Forbearing; there is no god except Allah, the Lord of the Mighty Throne;
there is no god except Allah, Lord of the heavens, Lord of the earth and Lord of the noble Throne.

[ayesha.ansari]

JazakAllah Khair,, great sharing, i would love to listen from you more INSHAllah...

[AsadullahHamza]

No soul has authority over another. Guidance and straying is a matter between God and you.


aakwrAllahwbHu

JazakAllah Khair,, great sharing, i would love to listen from you more INSHAllah...

And we would like to hear more from you, my respected sister.

Alhamdu lillahi Rabbil aalameen.



la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Al-�Atheemu Al-Haleemu, la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbul �arshil-�atheemi,
la ilaaha illaa Allaahu Rabbus-samaawaati wa Rabbul-ardhi wa Rabbul-�arshil-kareemi
there is no god except Allah, the All-Mighty, the Forbearing; there is no god except Allah, the Lord of the Mighty Throne;
there is no god except Allah, Lord of the heavens, Lord of the earth and Lord of the noble Throne.