Did Mawiah Face Any Accountability During The Rein Of First Three Caliphs?, Did Mawiah ever face any accountability during the rein of three calip Options

[Bar Haq]

Not just love, but I extremely love and respect him , I hope you understand it this time.

Kalaam... Would it be fair to deem that had you been present at the time of Safeen, we would have found you in the forces of Mawiah fighting against Imam Ali (a.s.)...

And your unquestionable affection and love for Mawiah, would have further given him the comfort to assume that he has ample love of people who can die for him, and would even die for his son, Yazeed ?

This post has been edited by Bar Haq: Oct 27 2010, 12:37 AM

[Kalaam]

Kalaam... Would it be fair to deem that had you been present at the time of Safeen, we would have found you in the forces of Mawiah fighting against Imam Ali (a.s.)...

And your unquestionable affection and love for Mawiah, would have further given him the comfort to assume that he has ample love of people who can die for him, and would even die for his son, Yazeed ?

I love Ali way more than Muawiyah but just because I love Ali it doesn't mean that I should hate others.
It is only because of the unlimited ranting against some of the personalities, that leads me to show the reality to the people. Muawiyah was not better than Ali at all but he was of course way superior to the people nowadays who think themselves to be so pious as to have the authority to talk ill about Muawiyah .

[Bar Haq]

Kalaam... Would it be fair to deem that had you been present at the time of Safeen, we would have found you in the forces of Mawiah fighting against Imam Ali (a.s.)...

And your unquestionable affection and love for Mawiah, would have further given him the comfort to assume that he has ample love of people who can die for him, and would even die for his son, Yazeed ?

I love Ali way more than Muawiyah but just because I love Ali it doesn't mean that I should hate others.
It is only because of the unlimited ranting against some of the personalities, that leads me to show the reality to the people. Muawiyah was not better than Ali at all but he was of course way superior to the people nowadays who think themselves to be so pious as to have the authority to talk ill about Muawiyah .

Then, Theeenn

Is it fair to deem that we would have found you in the forces of Imam Ali (a.s.), fighting angainst Mawiah?

Please simple answer than reverting an art of diplomacy ?

Which side would you have been ?

[Kalaam]

Such a waste of time to discuss issues with you.

[Bar Haq]

Such a waste of time to discuss issues with you.

Let's not waste each other's time, if you are unable to take decisions to fathom which side you would have opted for?

It's the confused mind which has fourished confusion to its peak, and has indeed resulted into a rainbow of turbans .. ..oragne, red, brown, green, you name it and we get to see scholars of your school of thought, rather THOUGHTS, are wearing different color of turbans... while on the other side, we see a group following Islam with clear thoughts and only wears Black and White.... it exhibits a clear distinction of school of thoughts driven by clear and confused thoughts.

Allah (swt) has said numerous times in Al Quran that there are CLEAR signs in this world... obviously, we can't follow those who are not even CLEAR on which side they are?

[Kalaam]

You win, enjoy

[Bar Haq]

You win, enjoy

Allah 0 Akbar!!


We are waiting for the day, when justice will be done in the divine court and Mawiah and Yazeed will be punished for they took the revenge from Ahle Bayt (a.s.) for revealing Al Quran to public --- they were showing their own muscles like Pharoh, by putting chains in the neck of the grandsons (peace be upon all of them) of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), and in doing so, infact rejecting the following verses with their worldly might:


40: 70 Those who reject the Book and that with which We have sent Our Messenger; but they shall soon come to know,
40: 71 When the fetters and the chains shall be on their necks; they shall be dragged

This post has been edited by Bar Haq: Nov 2 2010, 12:07 AM

[Kalaam]

We are waiting for the day, when justice will be done in the divine court and Mawiah and Yazeed will be punished for they took the revenge from Ahle Bayt (a.s.) for revealing Al Quran to public ---

Oh Oh, that mysterious al Quran of Ahlelbayt again.

[Bar Haq]

Oh Oh, that mysterious al Quran of Ahlelbayt again.

it's the same Al Quran we read today, that is, from Alif Laam Meem to Wanaa's, which was revealed by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and his Ahle Bayt (a.s.) were its real protectors and waris, as per Hadith-e Thuqlainn...


Not sure which Mysterious book you are referring to --- may be from the fake sources of historical libyrnth, just to try to proof Shias are this and Shia's are that ... |get over it Kalam.

Shian-e Ali are muslims, and they do not believe in Threef-e Quran ... PERIOD.
These stories that Goats ate some pages of Al Quran and the Aya's in favor of Imam Ali (a.s.) were kept in secret etc etc are all a propaganda of Nasibis/Salafis and Wahabis.

[Kalaam]

it's the same Al Quran we read today, that is, from Alif Laam Meem to Wanaa's, which was revealed by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and his Ahle Bayt (a.s.) were its real protectors and waris, as per Hadith-e Thuqlainn...


Not sure which Mysterious book you are referring to --- may be from the fake sources of historical libyrnth, just to try to proof Shias are this and Shia's are that ... |get over it Kalam.

Shian-e Ali are muslims, and they do not believe in Threef-e Quran ... PERIOD.
These stories that Goats ate some pages of Al Quran and the Aya's in favor of Imam Ali (a.s.) were kept in secret etc etc are all a propaganda of Nasibis/Salafis and Wahabis.

I am dazzled

[Bar Haq]

it's the same Al Quran we read today, that is, from Alif Laam Meem to Wanaa's, which was revealed by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and his Ahle Bayt (a.s.) were its real protectors and waris, as per Hadith-e Thuqlainn...


Not sure which Mysterious book you are referring to --- may be from the fake sources of historical libyrnth, just to try to proof Shias are this and Shia's are that ... |get over it Kalam.

Shian-e Ali are muslims, and they do not believe in Threef-e Quran ... PERIOD.
These stories that Goats ate some pages of Al Quran and the Aya's in favor of Imam Ali (a.s.) were kept in secret etc etc are all a propaganda of Nasibis/Salafis and Wahabis.

I am dazzled

I think the correct expression would be "Astonished"

[Nafs-az-Zakiyah]

Found this on a shia blog.



in al-bidaya wa nihaya

وقال عمرو بن يحيى بن سعيد الاموي، عن جده.
قال: دخل معاوية على عمر وعليه حلة خضراء، فنظر إليها الصحابة، فلما رأى ذلك عمر وثب إليه بالدرة فجعل يضربه بها، وجعل معاوية يقول: يا أمير المؤمنين الله الله في، فرجع عمر إلى مجلسه فقال له القوم: لم ضربته يا أمير المؤمنين ؟ وما في قومك مثله ؟ فقال: والله ما رأيت إلا خيرا، وما بلغني إلا خير، ولو بلغني غير ذلك لكان مني إليه غير ما رأيتم، ولكن رأيته – وأشار بيده – فأحببت أن أضع منه ما شمخ.

mawia came in wearing green dress, and he was wearing greed dress; so umar saw him; and started beating him with lash

this made mawia say: allah allah! o amir ul momineen!

so umar returned to where he was sitting; then people asked: what made you whip him o amir ul momineen? he is like this nation? he said: i have seen better things in him, otherwise, i would have done what you have not seen; but i saw this; and he pointed with his hand; and so i decided to take out this sign of pride

http://www.islamww.com/booksww/pg.php?b=3946&pageID=2985

this narration is also present in tareekh madina damishq

http://www.islamww.com/booksww/pg.php?b=40...mp;pageID=27200

and also present in sair ul aalam nabala; 3/135

http://ahlubait.wordpress.com/2010/08/28/u...ah-with-a-lash/

[Bar Haq]

Found this on a shia blog.



in al-bidaya wa nihaya

وقال عمرو بن يحيى بن سعيد الاموي، عن جده.
قال: دخل معاوية على عمر وعليه حلة خضراء، فنظر إليها الصحابة، فلما رأى ذلك عمر وثب إليه بالدرة فجعل يضربه بها، وجعل معاوية يقول: يا أمير المؤمنين الله الله في، فرجع عمر إلى مجلسه فقال له القوم: لم ضربته يا أمير المؤمنين ؟ وما في قومك مثله ؟ فقال: والله ما رأيت إلا خيرا، وما بلغني إلا خير، ولو بلغني غير ذلك لكان مني إليه غير ما رأيتم، ولكن رأيته – وأشار بيده – فأحببت أن أضع منه ما شمخ.

mawia came in wearing green dress, and he was wearing greed dress; so umar saw him; and started beating him with lash

this made mawia say: allah allah! o amir ul momineen!

so umar returned to where he was sitting; then people asked: what made you whip him o amir ul momineen? he is like this nation? he said: i have seen better things in him, otherwise, i would have done what you have not seen; but i saw this; and he pointed with his hand; and so i decided to take out this sign of pride

http://www.islamww.com/booksww/pg.php?b=3946&pageID=2985

this narration is also present in tareekh madina damishq

http://www.islamww.com/booksww/pg.php?b=40...mp;pageID=27200

and also present in sair ul aalam nabala; 3/135

http://ahlubait.wordpress.com/2010/08/28/u...ah-with-a-lash/

Links are not properly working. Would be interested to learn more about the precise sources it's quoted from..

he said: i have seen better things in him,


hmm.. half cooked statement, otherwise open to conclude that Omar was seeing him lobbying against Imam Ali (a.s.) in future, and only supporting him in invading other countries to expand his kingdom by sword...

[Nafs-az-Zakiyah]

I checked the blog the link works.

http://ahlubait.wordpress.com/2010/08/28/u...ah-with-a-lash/

Also, you still didn't give me one statement from our books where Imam Ali says Umar set up Muawiyah prepare him against me. So far your views are only speculation.

[Kalaam]

The good thing in Muawiyah was that he was defending the Muslim empire from the Romans and he was the governor of the province which was at the boundary of the Romans and this place, he conquered with his brother Yazeed bin Sufiyan. And he was loved by his people.

وقال عمرو بن يحيى بن سعيد الاموي، عن جده.
قال: دخل معاوية على عمر وعليه حلة خضراء، فنظر إليها الصحابة، فلما رأى ذلك عمر وثب إليه بالدرة فجعل يضربه بها، وجعل معاوية يقول: يا أمير المؤمنين الله الله في، فرجع عمر إلى مجلسه فقال له القوم: لم ضربته يا أمير المؤمنين ؟ وما في قومك مثله ؟ فقال: والله ما رأيت إلا خيرا، وما بلغني إلا خير، ولو بلغني غير ذلك لكان مني إليه غير ما رأيتم، ولكن رأيته – وأشار بيده – فأحببت أن أضع منه ما شمخ.

mawia came in wearing green dress, and he was wearing greed dress; so umar saw him; and started beating him with lash

this made mawia say: allah allah! o amir ul momineen!

so umar returned to where he was sitting; then people asked: what made you whip him o amir ul momineen? he is like this nation? he said: i have seen better things in him, otherwise, i would have done what you have not seen; but i saw this; and he pointed with his hand; and so i decided to take out this sign of pride

who translated this by the way? where is the bold arabic text in the translation? and where is the bold text in the translation in the arabic text? you present things from the website of deceivers? fear Allah and don't trust shias when it comes to sahaba. they lie more than any cult.


This post has been edited by Kalaam: Nov 16 2010, 04:33 AM

[Bar Haq]

The good thing in Muawiyah was that he was defending the Muslim empire

I am glad you used the word MUSLIM EMPIRE than Islamic.
Indeed, son of Hinda, was helping Umar to expand his Kingdom through a deal struck by his Father Abu Sufiyan.

who translated this by the way? where is the bold arabic text in the translation? and where is the bold text in the translation in the arabic text? you present things from the website of deceivers? fear Allah and don't trust shias when it comes to sahaba. they lie more than any cult.

Here we go again -- not a pixel left on any such discussion forum to put a blame on Shias... an easy lame excuse and escape goat from rebutting constructively.

I could imagine, had Kalam been present at the time of Safeen, he would have been the Chief of Army Staff for Mawiah's Army against Imam Ali's (a.s.) army.


Nafs : The link to the blog is the same as what you posted without any proper reference quotations.

This post has been edited by Bar Haq: Nov 18 2010, 12:33 AM

[Kalaam]

I am glad you used the word MUSLIM EMPIRE than Islamic.
Indeed, son of Hinda, was helping Umar to expand his Kingdom through a deal struck by his Father Abu Sufiyan.

Do you know what the son of Abu Talib called the army of Umar ? Check nahjul balagha before giving fabolous answers as always.

[Bar Haq]

I am glad you used the word MUSLIM EMPIRE than Islamic.
Indeed, son of Hinda, was helping Umar to expand his Kingdom through a deal struck by his Father Abu Sufiyan.

Do you know what the son of Abu Talib called the army of Umar ? Check nahjul balagha before giving fabolous answers as always.

No I don't know what did Son of Imran ( Abu Talib (a.s.)) called Umar's Army in Nahjul Balagha -- why don't you englighten us here, but then be prepared to listen for what Umar was referred as by Aale Imran (a.s.)...

This post has been edited by Bar Haq: Nov 19 2010, 12:06 PM

[Kalaam]

No I don't know what did Son of Imran ( Abu Talib (a.s.)) called Umar's Army in Nahjul Balagha -- why don't you englighten us here, but then be prepared to listen for what Umar was referred as by Aale Imran (a.s.)...

than read if you don't know

Sermon 145
Spoken when `Umar ibn al-Khattab consulted Amir al-mu'minin about taking part in the battle of Persia. (1)

In this matter, victory of defeat is not dependent on the smallness or greatness of forces. It is Allah's religion which He has raised above all faiths, and His army which He has mobilised and extended, till it has reached the point where it stands now, and has arrived its present positions. We hold a promise from Allah, and He will fulfil His promise and support His army.

Ali was actually calling the army of Umar , God's army, and a God's army works for a kingdom of the servants of God. and it is clear from the sermon that Ali had not the views as the shiites of today hold, who claims that Umar was expanding his kingdom, rather Ali viewed the kingdom as the kingdom of Muslims and its expansion as the expansion of Muslims kingdom , and the army as the God's army. Further, the person with a slight common sense can understand well.

[Nafs-az-Zakiyah]

Nafs : The link to the blog is the same as what you posted without any proper reference quotations.

You didn't provide a single reference from your research. All you did is copy and paste everything since the day you joined or parroted what your marjas have told you. The link I provided is done by a 12r shia himself. Also I find it funny how you bring Siffin into this. Are you trying to suggest Imam Ali did not give political positions to any outwardly Muslim who had a bad record ?