Always I ask this question to every Christian I come across, never do I get an answer that actually makes sense.

Is Jesus God, or is he His son?

The bible makes reference to him as the son of God and also as God Himself. But which is it?

As far as I am concerned, you cannot be both.

Hi Killed Bill

Thanks for your question. I have already answered a similar question in another thread. For your convenience I post it here again. Relationally (not biologically) Jesus is the Son to the Father. Jesus and the Father are the different revelations of the same God, the Creator of the universe.

We worship only one God or His different revelation as the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Please do not be confused. Do you not agree that the almighty God could reveal Himself or His presence to human beings in a hundred different ways if He wants? Do you limit God’s ability and power?

Muslim readers like to make the following argument: 1 God (the Father)+1 God (the Son)+1 God (the Father Spirit) = 3 Gods. Therefore Christians worship three Gods. Certainly they are confused about deity and non-deity. They apply non-deity mathematics to deity. We cannot compare deity with non-deity. Deity is eternal, while non-deity is mortal. Deity is perfect, while non-deity is imperfect. Deity is pure, while non-deity is impure. The difference between deity and non-deity is like sky and land, and in fact even more. Deity is like infinity, while non-deity is like finite. For non-deity mathematics, 1 + 1 + 1 = 3. But deity mathematics, infinity + infinity + infinity = infinity, not 3 infinities. There is no such thing as 3 infinities.

I ask Muslim brothers to pray earnestly to your God (Allah) to reveal Jesus in your dream or vision if He is really the Son of God or not. I believe this is the best way to know the true nature of Jesus.

Thank you for your reply

You suggest that Jesus is a "revelation" of God. We believe that about Muhammad yet we view him very differently as you do with Jesus.

Muhammad is the sign and mercy of God, as was Jesus. However you apply divinity to Jesus? That is what I do not agree with. You are right that God shows Himself in many ways, but I cannot believe that Jesus is the living God. He was the B to get A to C

Hi Killed Bill

Thanks for your reply. Although I appreciate your view, Jesus is the living God whether you believe it or not. That is the natural conclusion after reading and pondering the implication of what Jesus said and more importantly what He did. You are free to believe whatever you choose to believe. But it does not change the fact that Jesus has both human and divine natures.

So like a semi god?

Then what can we call Jesus? A human or a God?

Hi Killed Bill

Thanks for your comment. Of course Jesus is God, who took a human form or revealed Himself in a human form. But human being can NOT take a God form or reveal themselves in a God form. It is impossible.

So God is His own son? That is still what I dont understand. If Jesus is the human form of God, then what is the need for this trinity?



Would that be the only reason they would refer him as the son of God? The fact that Jesus had no biological father?

Hi Killed Bill

Thanks for your reply. Of course you should not think the Father has the biological Son. It would be absurd to say that Jesus was born as a result of physical relationship between God and a woman. Jesus (the Word) was with the Father in the beginning. Jesus already existed long before he became flesh. “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.” (John 1:1-3) Here the Word means Jesus. When the Bible calls Jesus as the Son, it refers to the relationship between the Father and the Son, not a biological one.

Do you think that, since Jesus died for your sins, you need only to take him as your savior to be permitted to heaven? Or, do you believe that that act just gave mankind the ability to be able to pray to ask forgiveness of their sins?
My answer: Yes, taking him as your Savior is enough. As soon as you receive Jesus as the Savior and Lord in your heart, you would be changed dramatically inside out
“Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!” (2 Corinthians 5:17)

Hi FiziKx

I do not disagree with you. Receiving Jesus as the Savior and Lord is like being adopted onto the family of God from the enemy of God. Although we become the children of God by the sacrificial love of Jesus on the cross, much of our old self is not compatible with the new status. In other words, we still carry much of our sinful natures. We become more mature by following the word of God. Along the way we may fall due to our weakness to temptation. When it happens, we confess our sin and move on with hope and joy

no

Hi Ms. JJ

Thanks for your story. I appreciate it greatly. If I am not mistaken, I posted the following writing somewhere whch I do not know. But it does exlpain the origin of sin in relation to Satan. You are very welcome to share your comment with me and other readers. Thank you.

When God created the world, it was perfect. There was no sin, no death, and no tragedy. Adam and Eve were given full freedom to do whatever they wanted, but God wanted to make sure that He was the Creator and they (Adam and Even) were still his creatures, thus giving them one and only restriction, “But you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die” (Genesis 2:17). But they gave in to the temptation of the Satan, “you will be like God” (Genesis 3:5). In effect they said to God, “God, we want to be the Creator ourselves. We do not need you anymore. We ask you to leave our lives now and never return!” When Adam and Eve disobeyed God and ate of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, sin entered the world for the first time. Death, disease, pain, and senseless tragedies were the result. They are with us still. The separation from God is nothing but the curse for both mankind and the earth (Genesis 3:17-18), which was caused by our walking away from the Source of blessing and protection, rather than by God’s punishment. Though God was pushed out of our lives, He still loves and cares us who are created as the focus of his love. There is nothing more important to our Creator than for every one of us to have as much happiness and fulfillment as humanly possible. When bad things happen, God still feels our pain, is very present with us, and works to bring out the best in a bad situation.

Because of our sin and rebellion against the Creator, the loving relationship between God and human beings was broken and a huge gap of valley was created in between. The enormous gap of valley is like a Grand Canyon, 10 km wide and 10 km deep. In reality it is much much wider and deeper. Indeed our rebellion against the Creator (“God, we want to be the Creator ourselves. We do not need you anymore. We ask you to leave our lives now and never return!”) is a really really serious sin, more precisely speaking, the greatest sin ever possible to the Creator. Just performing religious rituals or duties (even with repentance) is not enough and is not even close to undo the greatest humiliation done to God! Something dramatic and amazing event should happen to make a way that would connect again the huge valley of separation. God has bridged the gulf which separates us from God by sending his son, Jesus Christ, to die on the cross in our place in order to pay the penalty for our sins. “This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.” (Matthew 26:28) And he invites us to the wonderful gift of eternal life, “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son (as a sacrifice for our sins) that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life” (John 3:16). And he points us the way to go, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). Jesus Christ is the way to restore the broken relationship with God.

Death, disease, pain, and senseless tragedies will happen again and again in the future, until we are completely returned and united with God again, the Source of blessing and protection. I may die tomorrow due to some unexpected accident or natural disaster or disease. You may have some loved ones who have been hurt or died due to a senseless accident, for which you may harbour bitterness and resentment toward God. We need to comfort and help those who suffer from the tragedies as much as we can. But when Jesus Christ returns as the King of kings and the Lord of lords someday, he will build a new heaven and a new earth where we will live forever with no tear, no pain and no death “Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea” (Revelation 21:1) “He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.” (Revelation 21:4)

Oh wait i think the Muslims believe in the return of Jesus as well.

is there any wise christiant who can answer us about those questions :

Jesus was not God. God is only one and that is ALLAH. In Quran it is clearly said that ALLAH has created jesus and he is the one who took jesus alive and send his substitute to people.

If you can access You tube I hope this helps. Very clear explanation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YamAD7Uhmc...1BB&index=1

I just wanted to point something out and something i always found interesting... is that the ideology christians have for Jesus/god, etc is very similar to what many Hindus believe. For example, it may appear that Hindus worship many gods, and this is how many Hindus believe as well, but if you really look at it... say... Krishna, Rama are really just avatars or incarnations of Vishnu. Some sects view Vishnu as the supreme God. Some forms of Hinduism see Vishnu as one of 5 "forms" of God with Ganesha, etc. So it appears very monotheistic at its core when you think of it this way and I believe it is just as monotheistic as Christianity is. Anyway I don't want to say too mucb because my knowledge of HInduism is very limited as its a complex religion with many different belief systems and I think its hard to characterize one universal way that all Hindus believe. But at least in this sort of thinking I always find Christianity and HInduism to be on the same level of monotheism. I think that thought upsets many Christians but at least from an unbiased, outside perspective its always what I feel

Maybe I'll start a thread on this because I always thought this was an interesting comparison.

Christians don't worship the cross, the cross is a symbol of the religion. I can't find answers to any of my questions concerning the religion, and I was raised a christian. Oh, some try very hard to answer but the answers never feel like answers to me. I guess that's a reason why I want to convert (revert?! ) to Islam. Islam makes so much more sense to me.

For those of you who didn't watch the you tube here is what it said.

Basic definition of trinity.

Within the one Being that is God, There exits eternally three coequal and coeternal Persons, namely, the Father the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

A vital distinction

"Within the one Being that is God, there exists eternally three coequal and coeternal Persons, namely, the Father, the Son, and the Holy spirit."

Being and Person are different things: Being is what makes something what it is, Person is what makes someone who they are.

The Most common Misunderstanding

The trinity is not saying that there are three Beings who are one Being, nor three Persons who are one Person. One Being, eternal, and unlimited, shared by three divine Persons, Father, son, and Holy Spirit.

I hope that helps. A true unbiased scholar is one who shows a fair argument for all religions.

For those of you who didn't watch the you tube here is what it said.

Basic definition of trinity.

Within the one Being that is God, There exits eternally three coequal and coeternal Persons, namely, the Father the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

A vital distinction

"Within the one Being that is God, there exists eternally three coequal and coeternal Persons, namely, the Father, the Son, and the Holy spirit."

Being and Person are different things: Being is what makes something what it is, Person is what makes someone who they are.

The Most common Misunderstanding

The trinity is not saying that there are three Beings who are one Being, nor three Persons who are one Person. One Being, eternal, and unlimited, shared by three divine Persons, Father, son, and Holy Spirit.

I hope that helps. A true unbiased scholar is one who shows a fair argument for all religions.

I would disagree. Hindus believe everything is part of the one God. The table is God the car is god everything. Christians do not believe that idea. Here is an explanation of trinity.

For those of you who didn't watch the you tube here is what it said.

Basic definition of trinity.

Within the one Being that is God, There exits eternally three coequal and coeternal Persons, namely, the Father the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

A vital distinction

"Within the one Being that is God, there exists eternally three coequal and coeternal Persons, namely, the Father, the Son, and the Holy spirit."

Being and Person are different things: Being is what makes something what it is, Person is what makes someone who they are.

The Most common Misunderstanding

The trinity is not saying that there are three Beings who are one Being, nor three Persons who are one Person. One Being, eternal, and unlimited, shared by three divine Persons, Father, son, and Holy Spirit.

I hope that helps. A true unbiased scholar is one who shows a fair argument for all religions.

Hindus believe you can envoke god into any of these objects, invite God to be in these objects, inviting God to have his presence in a murti, etc. to do a puja. No this isn't exactly how Christians believe but I don't really think this is that far fetched from Islam or Judaism or Christianity or any other religion that believes in God. I don't even see what's so bad (in Islamic terms) about that aspect of Hinduism. I don't see how it constitutes shirk

But back to what I said about Hindus believing certain Gods like Krishna and Rama are incarnations of VIshnu and how that correlates with the triinty, you didn't really address that properly

Hi Nazia1987

That is an interesting comparison. Of course I am not upset by your writing. Because I do not know much about Hinduism, I cannot make a strong comment on your comparison. Jesus was already mentioned specifically in the Old Testament long before He became flesh. One of the well-known chapters is Isaiah 53 (the suffering of Jesus Christ to forgive the whole human beings). Not a single verse, but the whole chapter! Please take a moment to read the chapter to think who it talks about.


1 Who has believed our message and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed? 2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground. He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. 3 He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not. 4 Surely he took up our infirmities and carried our sorrows, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted. 5 But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed. 6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all. 7 He was oppressed and afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; he was led like a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth. 8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away. And who can speak of his descendants? For he was cut off from the land of the living; for the transgression of my people he was stricken. 9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death, though he had done no violence, nor was any deceit in his mouth. 10 Yet it was the LORD's will to crush him and cause him to suffer, and though the LORD makes [c] his life a guilt offering, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand. 11 After the suffering of his soul, he will see the light of life and be satisfied; by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many, and he will bear their iniquities. 12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great, and he will divide the spoils with the strong, because he poured out his life unto death, and was numbered with the transgressors. For he bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

It looks like "Son of God" must be a name or a title ...
because God obviously never mated and had any offspring.
And no Christian I've talked to says He did.

Hello killed Bill!

I am a christian and I feel what it comes down to is who you think Jesus Christ was? Is he who he clearly says he is in the bible? Its a choice we all have to make.


For me the Bible is the word of God and I think that God protects his word and so I trust in the Bible totally.

In the Bible Jesus does many things to indicate who he is. It is not just in his words but in his actions he shows that he is God over and over again. He also says he is God. If you read the book with an open mind its very clear.

Jesus said 'I and the Father are one' John 10:30

Link to 'I and the Father are one'

"The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel"--which means, "God with us." Matthew 1:23

Link to and they will call him 'Immanuel' which means "God with us"

Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say that the Son of Man is?"And they said, "Some say John the Baptist, others say Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets." He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" Simon Peter replied, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." And Jesus answered him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven.'

Mark 14 chapter 60-65;

... Again the high priest asked him"Are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed one?"
"I am" said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty one and coming on the clouds of heaven."

Jesus answers 'I am' many times in the bible when he is asked who he is. This is important because in the Torah in Exodus 3 it says:

'Moses said to God, "Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you,' and they ask me, 'What is his name?' Then what shall I tell them?"

God said to Moses, "I am who I am. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I am has sent me to you.'"

The Old testament Prophet Zachariah wrote that that someone with salvation would arrive in Jerusalem/Zion on a colt please read link:

Zechhariah 9:9

Jesus fufilled this deliberately by arriving on the colt of a donkey. Please see link.

Mark 11

Mark 1:11:

And a voice came from Heaven 'you are my beloved son who I love and with whom I am well pleased.'

Luke 5: One day as he was teaching, Pharisees and teachers of the law, who had come from every village of Galilee and from Judea and Jerusalem, were sitting there. And the power of the Lord was present for him to heal the sick. Some men came carrying a paralytic on a mat and tried to take him into the house to lay him before Jesus.When they could not find a way to do this because of the crowd, they went up on the roof and lowered him on his mat through the tiles into the middle of the crowd, right in front of Jesus.

When Jesus saw their faith, he said, "Friend, your sins are forgiven."

The Pharisees and the teachers of the law began thinking to themselves, "Who is this fellow who speaks blasphemy? Who can forgive sins but God alone?"

In John 11:25 Jesus says:

"I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies; and whoever lives and believes in me will never die. Do you believe this?"

"Yes, Lord," she told him,"I believe that you are the Christ, the Son of God, who was to come into the world."

Luke 4:14:21

"Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the spirit, and news about him spread through the countryside. He taught in the synagogues, and everyone praised him.

He went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went to a synagogue, as he was his custom. And he stood up to read. The scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:

The Spirit of the Lord is on me
because he has anointed me
to preach the good news to the poor
He has sent me to proclaim freedom for
the prisoners
and recovery for the sight of the blnd
to release the oppressed,
to proclaim the year of the Lord's
favour

Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him, and he began by saying to them 'Today this scripture is fufilled in your hearing.'"

Isaiah 61 from the old testament/Torah

Jesus says he came to fufill that prophercy. The choice of if you chose to accept him as God who he claims he is again and again through words and his actions is yours.

I believe that Jesus behaves with Gods authority and power. I could go on and on about this subject!. But the choice of what you believe is yours alone.

Thanks for giving me the chance to talk about Jesus its been a pleasure

May God bless you